[00:00:00] Donny Dvorin: The world is waking up to the power of crypto. And we are seeing this with new NFT and token launches every day, all using blockchain technologies. We’re also seeing huge marketing spends by crypto exchanges and platforms. And so this season, we are speaking to the marketing leaders of those crypto companies hosted by brave software in me, Dani, Devon.

[00:00:27] You’re listening to a new episode of the brave marketer podcast. And this one features Chris Ghent. Who’s the global head of brand strategy and partnerships at near protocol. And he’s an award-winning marketer and entrepreneur who started his career launching e-commerce retail startups. Back in 2005.

[00:00:43] Chris has worked with leading traditional and block chain brands, including Braker, which was formerly singular DTV first Republic. Harmon international industries most recently Tezos. And now he’s at near, I think you’re going to like [00:01:00] this episode a lot because we get into some of the crypto 1 0 1 vocabulary, little bit of layer, one, a little bit of sharding.

[00:01:08] We go into. we talk about creative collaborations for mainstream adoption of crypto. and we talk about nears partnership with dead mouse. And then we talk about why it’s important to think about NFTs outside their normal collectible and art application and what you can do with Dows and games and shows and TVs and how NFTs can be integrated into nearly everything.

[00:01:34] So as far as our pick of the week, we want to highlight Ford. So this was a big one for us. A lot of our users asked for mainstream advertisers and we delivered and Ford used brave To announce the launch of their new affordable hybrid Ford Maverick pickup truck. They ran sponsored image and push notifications to drive awareness for the new truck.

[00:01:58] And they got a [00:02:00] ton of talkability amongst brave users on sites like Twitter and Reddit. how awesome the new truck looked and how they were excited and how it was affordable. And it was always good to get mainstream brands up on brave because our users are always excited about that. It with no further ado.

[00:02:16] Here’s another episode of the brave

[00:02:19] Chris Gent: marketer.

[00:02:26] Donny Dvorin: Chris welcome to the brave marketer podcast.

[00:02:30] great to have you on, we’ve been a big fan of your marketing work, especially all the work that you’ve done with brave. you’ve been working with us for a little while. Can you tell us your journey with brave will start.

[00:02:42] Chris Gent: Yeah. I’ve been working with you guys, almost from, I’d say at the beginning, especially from the ad side, I mean, I was early like alpha and beta user of the ads product. funny enough that you guys used to basically give me money and credits on the platform to go out and get. Test your media platform.

[00:02:56] So, times have shifted and changed, but, originally was doing some work at [00:03:00] a company called singular DTV, or breaker, really to do some driving of people, to their deaths.

[00:03:05] but then, you know, across my time, in the Tezos ecosystem and now at mirror, I’ve been working with you guys on everything from push notifications to sponsored images, to actually recently starting to use the new, newsfeed ad format do some testing.

[00:03:18] and so being able to actually see your all always evolution and as a marketer are seeing a new, kind of opportunity to reach, audiences actually engage, in a very different way. I’ve been huge advocate, not only because of, the performance side of the project and the products, but actually.

[00:03:32] for us, it really has been the seamless UX has been something that, has kept me coming back. I think when you dive in and you’ve actually used brave ads platform, you know, you start to find out all these weird kind of things about way the crypto space and how, folks actually like to go back and write ads.

[00:03:48] so generating some feedback loops and that kind of stuff, but it’s been basically since 2019, that I’ve been with you guys and, across different ecosystems from Ethereum to Tezos to now near. And I have to say it’s still [00:04:00] one of highest performing,products that I’ve seen, across all the formats, frankly.

[00:04:04] Yeah, that’s

[00:04:05] Donny Dvorin: great. Well, thank you for that huge endorsement. The last survey that I saw was that 85% of our 50 million users have traded cryptocurrencies in the past 30 days. And when I say trade, I just mean bought or sold. So it literally has become. The largest place to advertise if you’re a crypto advertiser.

[00:04:29] And so it doesn’t surprise me that it’s, the best performing than other mediums out there. okay. So you’ve been at your new job at NIR for six weeks. Let’s start with what attracted you to go over to Newport?

[00:04:44] Chris Gent: Yeah. I mean, I was, uh, off for the summer, had, my son in August and really no muscle tone.

[00:04:55] And, I was watching the space and, got recruitment outreach call. and I’ve [00:05:00] been really looking at projects and seeing like, what’s real, what’s fake. where’s there a kind of more momentum, what’s happening with kind of everything with, you know, prices booming and all that stuff.

[00:05:09] But really where’s their, if they’re treating. and I have to say after little bit of dating, I’d say the near team and really getting down to like what made it special? decided to come out of my, I guess, crypto retirement, if you will. and really decided I was going to dive in. team had a ton going for it in terms of the ability to like unlock itself as a brand, and even use the brand as like use cases for itself, and was super impressed by the tech.

[00:05:33] so for me, I basically moved over and said, ah, let’s go in, let’s build the brand that is near that most folks don’t know about. and after having worked in this ecosystem and working in the Ethereum ecosystem, you know, I found that there was an opportunity for. layer one to really go after owning and operating as a brand.

[00:05:50] and this team fully understood that got that, especially in the competitive market space that we’re in right now. so I’m here, dove right in, ended up, in Lisbon for New York con and web [00:06:00] summit. I was recently in Miami, and now I’m over in Switzerland. so really getting the full, back in the blockchain world.

[00:06:07] Well,

[00:06:07] Donny Dvorin: you are on a world tour. So for those that don’t know near really well, what would you say the elevator pitches or the USP, the unique selling proposition is of near?

[00:06:17] Chris Gent: Yeah, I mean, honestly the biggest pieces are it’s easy to use. it’s simple, secure, scalable, scale. honestly a lot of people would talks a salon on a lot of those things.

[00:06:27] Near as in a lot of ways, pretty unique, right? It’s proof of stake, blockchain, it’s shorted. So when you’re talking about how do you get to scalability effectively, as sharding scales, infinite throughput,

[00:06:37] near is really uniquely positioned from a technological perspective to actually be the chain that helps enable that.

[00:06:43] Donny Dvorin: Okay, got it. Furthermore, novice people on the phone. Cause we haven’t really done a lot of, tutorials in this podcast and we’re doing more and more crypto advertising. this series, can you just share, what you mean by layer one and maybe define sharding and just go, not too [00:07:00] technical, but just, you know, background as to, what those terms.

[00:07:04] Chris Gent: Yeah. I mean, if you’re new to layer ones, most of you probably know what theory M and, you’ve probably potentially heard of products. Like I mentioned, Tezos,another proof of stake blockchain. but really when you start to look at, other projects in the space, like a salon, or like a near all of them effectively, or like that computation layer where a lot of things on chain are happening.

[00:07:24] so it’s the way or that effectively dApps and apps are built on top of, and if you don’t know dapper up,it’s decentralized applications. but in a lot of ways, the interesting part of nearer is. From a user friendly perspective, even the language we’re using, right. we talk about applications and we don’t necessarily focus on, the explicit nature of dApps where the things built on top are decentralized applications.

[00:07:45] Right. and when you start to think about terms like sharding, which really is talking about how the data is broken up,when you’re getting into like validation and all of that, and when you start to look at these things, Proof of stake and, layer ones. I think the big risk that we all run in this industry [00:08:00] is jargon, and forgetting the fact that a lot of folks that are coming into this space have not been here as long as many of us have.

[00:08:05] I mean, I’m a little over three years in, there’s still stuff that I’m learning every day. Not always put the technical stuff right in front of you, but let’s actually give you a product that you can tend to really have in your hands, and that you can play with and go,it’s not scary. as I think a lot of people probably believe

[00:08:21] Donny Dvorin: got it. How’s the fees and the speed compared to something like.

[00:08:26] Chris Gent: it’s fees and speed like it, the finalities fast. I think it’s a second or something like that, is the actual speed. but when we’re starting to talk about, Fees the fees are low, especially when you’re talking in comparison to, to Ethereum and salon up. I don’t know the stat off the top of my head, but, I know it’s comparative.

[00:08:44] I think the reality is, when you’re talking layer one and you’re talking longer tail throughput and you know, where our consumer is going to spend time and not just folks that are really focused on things like defy and other areas where most people are playing today. a chain like near it’s actually really well [00:09:00] positioned to, to scale.

[00:09:01] because of sharding, to actually enable that, I’d say frictionless feature, if you will, that’s watching. I will

[00:09:06] Donny Dvorin: got it. Got it. Got it. Love it. Good. so what’s the most exciting thing you’re working on? Obviously you’re doing a ton of travel, what excites you in the morning when.

[00:09:14] Chris Gent: Nah. I mean, what excites me is actually honestly driving that connectivity and driving adoption. think for us, the most exciting thing I’ve worked on right now, actually just came out of Miami. we just launched, with dead mouse, on mint base, effectively the. Dead mouse by Portugal, the man, by wooden Cyclops from an art perspective, I’m really trying to go platinum on chain.

[00:09:33] So when you think about, you know, we all hear about this notion of decentralization and changing kind of an empowering the artists. it’s pretty unique the dead mouse and Portugal demand team have released a, And I’m basically saying, Hey, let’s take this single platinum on chain. we were able to actually do some really fun advertising around it where, you know, we’re talking about near the brand as being something that’s easy, and climate neutral, which I think is actually, has been a big part of the conversation since earlier this year.

[00:09:57] with the, an artist like that, to be able to go out and say, [00:10:00] Hey, from like an advertising piece or from, you know, the side of a bus, you can literally scan the side of a bus. You can open it up. You can have a very simple like account structure, like your name dot near, and effectively go right in buy in at your first NFT.

[00:10:15] and with that being a music based NFT on mint base. Pretty powerful. When you think about the ease of user experience, which I would also say is something that the teams here at near have really put as something that’s front and forward, whether it’s on the developer side for onboarding and building, and language choices and all of that, all the way through to, the ability for a user to get an account and not have to deal with.

[00:10:37] I hate to say it, some of the challenges that things like meta mask and other wallets that are out there. and that’s not to say that there haven’t been a ton of improvements in that space, but when you start to look at, Hey, if I can literally go to the side of a bus, get a while I created, I get my first NFT.

[00:10:51] Like it’s pretty frictionless. And to me, that’s where you’re going to start to see new people coming in and tinker, and some of the barriers of immediately removed. [00:11:00]

[00:11:00] Donny Dvorin: That’s awesome. Do you have any data on how that did, like were people doing it.

[00:11:03] Chris Gent: still running. So we’re actually, we’ll start to get wrap-ups, end of month from Miami, but we’re actually watching a very similar campaign.

[00:11:09] I would dead mouse as well in New York and San Francisco. So we’re actually going on a little bit of a city tour, if you will, with the, let’s go platinum, initiative. But, I’d say I’ll share some of that data when we get it. But I will say I know that, w we’ve been able to actually directly engage with folks around our Basel and engage that

[00:11:24] Donny Dvorin: committee.

[00:11:25] That’s great. That’s great. so for our listeners, everybody knows that I always ask for that brave marketing moment, that moment, where you went outside of your comfort zone and took a risk. Chris, what’s your bridge marketing moment? I

[00:11:38] Chris Gent: would actually say leaving a fairly comfortable position in growing career in agencies.

[00:11:43] I mean, I’m a former MDC partners employee now stag wall, after the rebrand and mergers, But, you know, I was working very closely with the chairman and CEO of Scott Kauffman, on a number of initiatives, some, nonprofit fundraising to, opportunities within holding company to develop new ways of going [00:12:00] to market.

[00:12:00] and honestly I left that and decided I was going to go full time into blockchain, crypto space. and part of the reason why was I really started to see from the outside that, you know, the entire space had that communication. it wasn’t just the words that were coming out. It wasn’t just the insider speak.

[00:12:15] It was truly like the brand identity, the go-to markets, the ability for people to actually start using this stuff. and while the tech in and of itself was still kind of growing when I jumped in what, 2018, I’ve been watching this space since 2012, a very good friend, Former coworker, stark was one of the co-founders of super rare.

[00:12:32] and so, you know, we used to get pitched after meetings saying, Hey, you got to pay attention to Bitcoin in the future. And, when it started to really see the space, mature in a way that you could see where the potential was going even further, you could argue, I, I jumped in late, but it was early enough to actually start to have impacted.

[00:12:48] Have conversation around, you know, how do you not just build brands that have, for example, the Ethereum logo in the identity? cause there’s a lot of folks that are passionate about this space, but when you start to get into, well, how are you going to get millions and [00:13:00] billions of people on board? It’s you gotta make this thing feel comfortable, or you gotta build brands that have a little bit of identity and, trust built in a lot of ways that make people comfortable.

[00:13:09] so for me it was jumping into. and really diving headfirst, and frankly that’s, what’s landed us here to talk. but for me it also went downstream, and unlocked opportunities that I never would’ve thought could have been possible. through some of that work with, the ALS association that we’re doing within the holding companies.

[00:13:25] We ended up actually, back in July launching major league baseball’s first NFTE, in honor of Lou Gehrig, to raise awareness of, Luke Eric Day. past of ALS and effectively title vehicle laws, but the one of one, but we ended up raising nearly a hundred grand, with mop obeys first of T for ALS.

[00:13:40] So when I think about the trajectory of having taken, I’d say that chance, back in 2018 and leaving that comfortable career, it’s actually unlocked more creative opportunities than ever with.

[00:13:50] Donny Dvorin: That is amazing. And I mean, that’s the whole point where you take a risk and you step out of the comfort zone and it pays off, you do something different.

[00:13:57] Everyone’s saying, what the hell is pic coin, what’s this [00:14:00] crypto thing. And like, you’re going to go do it. Full-time and bet your career on it and it’s paid off. And so when was your, just on a personal note, when was your first. Buy into crypto or buy a Bitcoin?

[00:14:11] Chris Gent: I think the first bite I want, it’s actually 2016 and it wasn’t much, so I was one of those folks that made a ton, but it was one of those things where I do have, and really just to play around, and see, like, how does any of this stuff work?

[00:14:22] is it easy to use and really start to tinker and pressure test, you know, wallets and all of that.

[00:14:27] Donny Dvorin: Got it. Cool. so what marketing innovations are you finding important for crypto blockchain projects to drive mass adoption? I’d love your example with the bus. And I don’t know if it’s a QR code or what it was, but what do you think, is going to get us kind of really over that?

[00:14:45] Chris Gent: I think marketing innovations and I’ll throw the bus out there. Cause it’s something that actually wasn’t true innovation. we had the voted to leverage, on the side of the bus link drops. And so part of that while at onboarding experience was you’d get a little bit of near to be able to go and participate in the ecosystem.

[00:14:59] and to be able [00:15:00] to show someone like it’s that easy, to me, those types of innovations, you start to think downstream of that. Well, what does that mean for an FDS? Could a brand actually drop you an NFT and that kind of, wallet process. and to me, it’s going to be those hacks that are. So native and web to that, oftentimes I think that overlooked in web three, from a flow perspective and that user experience flow, where we’re going to remove a lot of barriers.

[00:15:20] I think part of the challenge is there’s a lot of research that you have to do to get into this space and start to understand where do I even get started. if I’m just a person that’s a non dev, like what do I do next? So I’ve got a wallet now. What? so for us, it really was, being able to say, Hey, you’ve got a wallet now.

[00:15:35] Hey, go participate in helping those artists go platinum one. and so for me, those types of very simple innovations where we can give you a wallet, we can help you get funded, and get moving. That’s a pretty amazing, innovation.

[00:15:46] Donny Dvorin: Yeah. Are you following at all? What, mainstream advertisers or mainstream brands are doing with crypto and NFTs and any good examples come to the top of your.

[00:15:56] Chris Gent: It’s interesting. I’ll say while it’s not as mainstream of [00:16:00] mainstream, it’s kind of mainstream to crypto. I think Gemini is doing a killer job. The stuff that they did in Columbus circle, right around actually the New York city marathon, was pretty brilliant. It’s like, Hey, how do you actually take something that is.

[00:16:11] so core to the crypto audience, in some of the Satoshi white paper pieces and turn those into NFTs and help people create wallets. I thought that was great. and very similar. It’s like, Hey, you’re taking a traditional medium that people are used to engaging with an out-of-home like we did in Florida and you’re starting to actually change the conversation.

[00:16:28] I think some of the other ones, honestly, I’m not the true brand side. I’ll be honest. There’s not a lot that I’m super impressed with these days because. Doesn’t have utility underneath of it. and I think the good side of that is there’s a lot of brands that are starting to dip their toe in and say, what can be.

[00:16:42] I think that, McDonald’s and some of the stuff they did around McRib was fun. but when you get into, and then what,what can you use that for? Can you burn it for the sandwich? Can you, do something different with it? is where I start to go. and I think that’s partially because when you’re in this space and you start to see what the tech can actually do, you go a little bit beyond just [00:17:00] the collectable piece of it.

[00:17:01] Donny Dvorin: Yeah. I see what I’m seeing now is like, For the NFT is it’s like the NFT. And then there’s maybe like a comic book series or a storyline or a show, or maybe a potentially a movie, and then there’s a game. And it’s like they’re creating a whole community and ecosystem. Of what you can do with these NFTs.

[00:17:23] And then each NFT has different value based on the significance and the game or the significance in the show or the movie, in people want those NFTs that are more unique and that have a higher use case and whatever the end output is. And I think that’s where it gets a really interesting versus some kid in their basement launching 10,000 NFTs.

[00:17:49] They use some AI technology and yeah, they look cool, but then it just stops there. And it’s like, where’s this.

[00:17:56] Chris Gent: Yeah. And I think when you think about it, right there is a layer here where some [00:18:00] NFTs are actually treated as like fine art. And I do think it’s worth calling out that is a great use case, right?

[00:18:04] you’re helping, digital native artists actually unlock value and to be able to live their passions and dreams. But I think when you think of NFT, it’s become so synonymous with art in and of it. That we forget it actually, it means non fungible token, right? So let’s say token type a and when you start to get into token type and what can that do?

[00:18:23] What can an online. The possibilities are quite infinite. And I think right now it’s been great that these types of things have stuck and gotten kind of mainstream attention. And I think as an industry, as we start to get into, and then what,and how are we going to take it that step further? And how is that going to impact things like Dow’s, and other things downstream, which we’re gonna have to get into too much detail here, but when you think about what a Dow can do for, an artist community, or,a musician community in that kind of.

[00:18:49] I think that’s where NFT has become a really interesting component of that, as you mentioned.

[00:18:53] Donny Dvorin: Yeah. The idea of Dow’s getting into, you’re living in an apart. Condo complex, [00:19:00] whatever it is with a thousand different apartments. And, you know, used to be a community situation, you’d have to vote on stuff and being able to do that via the Dao and then have voting and say, okay, we want to spend a thousand dollars to redo the garden in the front of the house.

[00:19:14] Like, I feel like over the next, five, 10 years, we’re going to see, hundreds of thousands of douse set up for all these different use cases. And then the NFTs, I mean, what’s not going to be an NFT, you know, your house, your sneakers, your piece of stock that you own your computer.

[00:19:31] Like just everything is going to have a NFT association with it. and it’s up to the user to make that unique,and create value. And if they want to resell it or whatever they want to do with it, I think the Dows and NFTs are probably. Two of the most exciting areas for me that I’m looking at, would you agree?

[00:19:48] Is there like a third or a fourth area that I should be.

[00:19:51] Chris Gent: I think the creator economy side of the world and endows are super exciting. And I will say, as a plug for an air, you know, a lot of that infrastructure exists. So to be able to come in [00:20:00] and start thinking about a Dow from a technical perspective, you can spin that up with things like,Astro Dow and a number of other projects that are actually built here.

[00:20:08] And the reality is like, that is possible. I kind of keep joking and get a little bit too plenty where it’s like, the future is near, but actually literally it’s here today. You can build these things. now when you get into, okay, and then how do you actually create the legal rappers and all that stuff around it too?

[00:20:23] I think, you know, the state of Wyoming and others are doing a really great job in leading some of that innovation. but I do, I think you’re right. You’re going to see a ton of these things start to spin up, cause it actually removes a ton of technical burden. and we used a better digital coordination at the end of the day.

[00:20:36] Yeah, that’s

[00:20:36] Donny Dvorin: great. bigger picture as we wrap up, opportunities and challenges and marketing and advertising as a whole, you know, you come from the agency world, where do you think, digital advertising going over the next 10 years and what are the challenges and what are the options?

[00:20:52] Chris Gent: I think the reality is right. The pixels dying, access to that type of data, whether it’s because of GDPR or [00:21:00] CCPA or any of the other regulatory, restrictions that are. I think, first of all, it’s good that they’re coming because the users are finally actually after what, 20 years of their data being prospected, maybe being respected.

[00:21:11] I think a lot of that data debt is still gonna be out there, right? Like you and I have been here in this space. That means people have enough data to probably understand who we are for 20 years from now. Human behaviors don’t change that much. but I think we are going way more privacy centric. I think we’re going to get to a place where the user is actually in control of how their data is used.

[00:21:29] opt-ins I think will be managed quite differently. and I think, not to give a, an explicit plug for brave, but at the same time, you guys have been pioneering a lot of the privacy side of this industry and really pushing that narrative forward. and I think if we’re honest with ourselves, not a lot of users cared about it a couple of years ago.

[00:21:44] And I think, from data breaches to other things, people are starting to realize, hold on, Hey, I can get rewarded for my information and for my opting in, and for my. And I don’t have to actually lose my identity in that process. That’s quite interesting. and so when you think about Dallas and all these other [00:22:00] things, crater wise, it’s actually, we’re going to see that shift to more privacy focused, features.

[00:22:04] and ultimately people realizing that the peer-to-peer economy is here and it’s real, and it’s not just this kind of scary crypto thing. It’s actually technology enablement, which is a natural evolution from where we are. I think most of us have grown up with apps and that kind of stuff, and understand that access to, applications requires data and that kind of things.

[00:22:23] Does that mean that we have to give up our literal human rights, in the process? I think we’re proving out daily that’s not the case. You can still have great ad experiences. I think when we’re thinking about the future of digital advertising, the focus on user experience is going to be, the thing that actually sets a lot of teams apart.

[00:22:38] Again, I’ll plug you guys. Some of the best performing media I’ve had is with a way better experience.

[00:22:42] I love a direct to consumer relationship for advertisers. I think brand relationships are no question going to be bolstered and built by that.

[00:22:50] Donny Dvorin: Yeah. And as the NFT gets bigger and bigger, I’ve been seeing more of our units being used for promoting NFTs.

[00:22:58] I haven’t seen it yet with dowels, [00:23:00] but as Dow’s become consumer facing, for whatever reason. I feel like that’s another area of growth for advertising. So, Chris, thank you for coming on. This has been an awesome conversation. Can you nominate another brave marketer that we should have on.

[00:23:16] Chris Gent: Yeah.I’d love to see you guys bring on George Alexa from Intel. I runs brand over there. I say that they’re running a good amount of media through you guys as well. but you know, he has someone that loves brands, gets how the strategy and go to markets work.

[00:23:28] Donny Dvorin: That’s awesome. Well, thank you so much, Chris. We appreciate it. how can, our users get into.

[00:23:34] Chris Gent: they can find me on Twitter. Very simple. It’s just at Christian, and, LinkedIn as well. It says, send me a DM. And if you’re looking for information to happy to share it, and then of course they can find us in our back and forth on LinkedIn and swell.

[00:23:50] Donny Dvorin: Perfect. Thanks, Chris. Talk to you soon. Awesome. If you like what you heard today and found it valuable, it would be super helpful. If you took one minute to leave us a short review [00:24:00] in apple podcasts, every review counts and helping us get to our show and more ears on one final note, if you have a. Product or service that you’d like to get in front of Braves over 50 million users.

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[00:24:44] And until next time .