[00:00:00] Luke: From privacy concerns to limitless potential, AI is rapidly impacting our evolving society. In this new season of the Brave Technologist podcast, we’re demystifying artificial intelligence, challenging the status quo, and empowering everyday people to embrace the digital revolution. I’m your host, Luke Maltz, VP of Business Operations at Brave Software, makers of the privacy respecting Brave browser and search engine, now powering AI with the Brave Search API.

[00:00:29] You’re listening to a new episode of the Brave Technologist. This one features Adam Zarazynski, who is a former intelligence professional that served as an analyst at Interpol and as an intelligence and operations judge advocate with the United States Air Force. Adam is now the CEO of Inca Digital, a fintech company that provides data and analytics on the digital asset ecosystem to government agencies financial institutions using natural language processing and LLMs.

[00:00:54] In this episode, we discussed how their technology is helping to monitor dark web activity and examples of how [00:01:00] they’ve been able to track Hamas use of cryptocurrency, how TradFi risk management is changing with Web3, and the big trends they’re seeing in tech driven value transfer. Now, for this week’s episode of the Brave Technologist.

[00:01:13] Adam, welcome to the Brave Technologist podcast. How are you doing today?

[00:01:20] Adam: Thanks. I’m good. Thanks for having me.

[00:01:22] Luke: Yeah. Yeah, no, I’m excited to have this conversation. So kind of set the table a bit. Can you kind of give our audience a little bit of background to how you ended up where you’re at with Inca and what you were doing?

[00:01:33] Adam: Yeah. My background is in intelligence. I got my start at Interpol. Before going to law school and then joining the air force and at Interpol, I was kind of doing something similar to what Inca does today. So we were taking a lot of unstructured data, primarily open source intelligence data, combining it together, and then feeding that to our clients at Interpol that were federal law enforcement agencies.

[00:01:58] So I did that for a number of years. [00:02:00] And after that went to law school, I joined the air force and I did, two years as a prosecutor. And two years doing operations and intelligence primarily in Afghanistan. And the other kind of impetus for Inca, which is a, it’s a data analytics and intelligence company, that’s crypto plus, not just exclusively crypto, but mostly, so the other impetus for it was my time in Afghanistan when I was deployed as a judge advocate, my job was primarily in operations.

[00:02:27] If you think about an operational life cycle. You’ve got the pre operation, so like what the operation is going to be, who we’re going to target, the actual operation itself, and then post operation, we do anything wrong or, you know, there’s intelligence that needs to be collected, stuff like that. And so I got kind of my introduction to crypto in that post operation phase.

[00:02:47] Part of my job was to apologize on behalf of the U. S. government. If we did something wrong, right? So if we accidentally blew up somebody’s house, that wasn’t supposed to be blown up, I’d fly out on a helicopter and typically pay the people, you know, who [00:03:00] lost a house or lost their livelihood, their, you know, their business or whatever, with a trash bag full of cash, which seems crazy, right?

[00:03:06] That I’m going out, you got like a, a dorky lawyer with a security team flying out on a black Hawk helicopter, paying somebody 20, 000 in USD, right. That doesn’t have access to a bank account. And so I thought, well, there has to be. A better way to do this, other than giving a trash bag full of cash. But of course, right, they don’t have Bank of America accounts either.

[00:03:25] Wire transfers don’t work. So what do you do? That is how I stumbled on crypto. And that was just a few short years later. I started Incon.

[00:03:32] Luke: Wow. That’s awesome. It’s super interesting too. I mean, like having that kind of mix of like, you know, operational level. And then also being a judge advocate, kind of both sides of the spectrum, right?

[00:03:41] That’s kind of wartime, right? What are you guys focusing on, like, in Inca? I mean, I imagine, like, I don’t know, is it still in the military world? Are doing more, like, civilian side stuff?

[00:03:51] Adam: Somewhat. Yeah, both. I can tell you about both. Yeah. So that was all the, the impetus for it. And, you know, really the goal ultimately, right.

[00:03:57] Is what I saw in the space as I was leaving the air force [00:04:00] was aside from the crypto forensics companies, which are good, right. They do good work. We partnered with a bunch of them aside from them. There’s not much else in the way of risk management and enterprise grade data analytics that leads to intelligence for sure.

[00:04:14] Large financial institutions for crypto financial service providers. That’s the niche that we fill and we fill it because ultimately, cause I, we want crypto to grow. We want the space to have proper risk management, privacy. I know this is probably important for your clients, privacy, preserving risk management.

[00:04:30] So we can talk a little bit about that. Yeah, but ultimately right to help the space grow, help companies mature and have it be in the United States as well. Foster business development here in the United States. Yeah, so that’s what we do. we really sit in the middle of traditional financial institutions that are moving into crypto, crypto native financial service providers and government agencies.

[00:04:50] you know, we do work for regulators. We do work with D. O. D. As well. And what we’re doing is we’re pulling unstructured data. Combining that together and then, spitting out intelligence typically in the form [00:05:00] of APIs, but also alerts, reports, and GUIs where we need to send out front ends.

[00:05:04] We work with a wide range of clients from big crypto exchanges like crypto. com to big banks, hedge funds, and then on the government side we work a lot with the Commodity Futures Trading Commission. We’ve got a big project with the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency too, on the DOD side.

[00:05:19] Luke: Just to get into kind of nuts and bolts of the work, right? Yeah. Let’s say like you have a client that wants you to, look at Token X. What are you doing for them? Walk me through a little bit about how folks are having you work.

[00:05:29] Adam: I’ll just give you like a couple of really specific examples. So we work with a layer one that has a token for them.

[00:05:34] We’re looking at. First of all, where their token is being listed, we’re doing analytics around market dynamics of that token. So where is the token being traded? What are the volumes? Is there wash trading happening? Is there front running happening on their token? They’re paying market makers to provide liquidity to that token.

[00:05:50] Is it quality liquidity or are they just dumping liquidity at regular intervals? They’re not actually providing quality liquidity. And then you take it a step further Is that token being used for the purchase [00:06:00] or sale of dark web activity, right? Anything from human trafficking to weapons trafficking to the sale of precursor fentanyl materials, you know, like those designer chemicals, it’s a big deal here in the U S things like that.

[00:06:13] And then for the layer one, we’re also looking at what scams are happening around the token. Are there people that are creating a fake token and then air dropping it into user wallets and stealing the actual token? We’ve seen that. Things like that.

[00:06:28] Luke: I’m just sitting here like kind of checking off the boxes in my head.

[00:06:31] Like, okay, we’ve been there done, but there’s a lot to that too, right? Like, I mean, so you guys like actually identifying these patterns of behavior. Yeah. Any one of those things is like a spinoff in itself of like having to look at this data in a certain way, even down to like watch trading or, or the things I would imagine.

[00:06:47] Yep. That’s pretty, pretty cool.

[00:06:49] Adam: There’s no like magic with the tech that we have. We spent five years building a microservice, really flexible microservice architecture that I’m sure many of your users are going to [00:07:00] know much more than me as a dumb military lawyer. The innovation at Inca is that we are able to go out, collect unstructured data very quickly, ingest that data.

[00:07:09] And the product ties very fast for our clients. That is what we’re doing. And you know, we’re seeing this not just in crypto, but I would say in financial services writ large, you know, the pace at which things move now, the pace at which market dynamics change and the pace around how you manage risk is so much faster.

[00:07:24] That is what we’re doing. And you’re right. Yeah, it’s, it’s a lot of data. We collect market data from over 350 crypto exchanges globally. We’re collecting blockchain data, of course, too. We’re not, we don’t have like a chain analysis front end GUI, but we’re still collecting that data. We’re collecting data from dark web.

[00:07:37] And then we currently have five going on six custom social media connectors. So we’ve got a Twitter, Reddit, Telegram, Discord, Mastodon and we’re working on WeChat. That’s what’s next.

[00:07:48] Luke: That’s wild. I mean, because it’s a huge amount of data, right? That’s just out there without having to like, even get into that user interface of like having to ask them to hand over data.

[00:07:57] This is just stuff that’s floating out there, you know, that you [00:08:00] guys are

[00:08:00] Adam: able to catch. It’s all OSINT. Yep. It’s all OSINT. Is it fair to

[00:08:03] Luke: say that like, given how blockchain’s activities published in the public, that you’re getting a level of transparency that lets you guys do what you’re doing that you wouldn’t really get otherwise?

[00:08:13] Adam: Absolutely. The ability to go out to social media, collect data from there, cross correlate that with wallet addresses and movements on the blockchain, and then the amount of data that you have just from the exchange, you know, from the order books of the exchanges themselves, combining all of those data sets is, the value that Inca brings, and yeah, and it’s something unprecedented in financial services that you’re not going to get anywhere else.

[00:08:33] This is another use case example, but I think it’s worth highlighting just because it’s still in the news. The Hamas example. So obviously, you know, Hamas used crypto as one way to launder funds to people on the ground. But we roughly know the order of magnitude, how much they raise with crypto. And we have no idea, like zero idea.

[00:08:53] Right, how much they do with cash, how much they do with bank transfers, how much they do with a wallet networks, how much they do with trade [00:09:00] based money laundering, right? So it’s kind of this like misunderstanding of what’s happening in crypto. You see those news headlines that I don’t even remember the exact numbers.

[00:09:07] So don’t quote me, but it was Yeah, a very small percentage of the total, you know, the total amount that Hamas raises every year was in crypto. But the fact is, is that we know that amount of money because of the transparency around crypto.

[00:09:19] Luke: Yeah, and it’s interesting because it kind of seems like you guys are providing two major services, right?

[00:09:23] Like for your customer, your clientele and your customers, you guys are able to kind of map out these different scenarios. But I think like writ large for the larger. Sense of crypto adoption, right? It seems like without services, like what you’re doing, everything’s going to get stuck in this black hoodie kind of, Oh, we’re using it to buy drugs on the dark web, kind of a scenario, right?

[00:09:42] Like, it seems like you guys are actually like offering up those bonafides in a way that your policymakers, other folks like that can actually like ingest and understand, is that a fair statement?

[00:09:51] Adam: you should come work at Inca and just, that’s the goal, man.

[00:09:55] Luke: As a person working on privacy software, it’s a super interesting [00:10:00] situation because you want to have the security and the transparencies that blockchains bring, right.

[00:10:05] And then, you know, we want to have like first principle privacy as good as we can and offer users really good tools. But also like you guys are able to do this without having to do like what Google does, where they’re just harvesting your data on the client, like client side to the cloud. You guys are actually just like looking at what’s out there, which is super interesting.

[00:10:22] And I think it’s something that’s underplayed like a lot in this space antagonistic against crypto, where like just a case in point, like if Elizabeth Warren goes and talks about how bad crypto is for Hamas, do you’re saying, well, actually, I can actually know what they’re using it for.

[00:10:36] Like, I can’t do that otherwise. Right. Like, and then a super pro crypto person would say, well, has been used for these things forever. But then you’re saying, well, We don’t know what the specific flows of that cash look like, right? So it’s super interesting. It’s definitely like a shift in an upgrade, but it’s really interesting coming at it from a privacy perspective.

[00:10:52] Cause it’s like, okay, we working on things in a certain realm, but when you’re working with public data, it’s public data and users are putting it out.

[00:10:58] Adam: Yep. It’s public data. I [00:11:00] think the privacy preserving element is an important thing. I’m sure it’s important for you guys. Yeah, it’s definitely important for the exchanges.

[00:11:06] Right. Where they don’t want to give over user information to a third party. That’s okay. We can achieve our goals without it. Just by looking at OSINT and just by combining the data sets that we have access to publicly in the right way. Preserves privacy for users. Still allows financial services to manage risk, handle their compliance needs, things like that.

[00:11:25] Luke: So what trends do you kind of foresee like in FinTech and particularly kind of with regulatory compliance and security the digital asset and crypto space near term ish? Yeah.

[00:11:34] Adam: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I see crypto as part of a, a larger trend in a shift in how firms manage risk specifically risk management compliance is a part of that, but it’s also kind of different.

[00:11:48] Social media is just one example, but it’s a good example. Like social media hitting finance is just one example. Now starting to like actually take effect and have an effect. Silicon Valley [00:12:00] Bank is a great example of that, right? It was a social media driven bank run. We have data on things like that.

[00:12:04] Meme stocks are another one. Meme stock phenomena, right? Is like an earlier example of something that’s going to be happening more and more across finance, not just in crypto. And I think in a lot of ways, crypto is just a leading indicator of what’s going to be happening across finance. With, you know, the Bitcoin ETF being approved, I think you’re seeing more and more large traditional financial institutions move into crypto.

[00:12:25] We’ve definitely seen an uptick in trust in our products and services and stuff like that from TradFi, whereas like post FTX crypto winter, it was tough going like right afterwards. Like everybody put a freeze on everything. A lot of firms moved overseas. You know, I’m sure you guys saw it too, right?

[00:12:41] Even like folks that

[00:12:42] Luke: had like debit cards or whatever or processors, right? we’re just like the banking relationships were just getting cut off like crazy right after that. It was like everybody just froze the whole market almost. It felt like. At least from the U. S. perspective.

[00:12:54] Adam: Yeah, absolutely from the U.

[00:12:55] S. perspective. yeah, exactly. I think that’s starting to come back now. We’re seeing more and more big [00:13:00] trad fight coming in. Building products, building services. I mean, not all of it is pure crypto. Not all of it is Bitcoin. A lot of it can be even crypto adjacent. They’re forking some blockchain and using it for some specific purpose or for some process within some product.

[00:13:15] We’re seeing a lot of that, which I think is gonna hopefully drive more interest in on the policy side as well. I still think it’s bigger than crypto. You know, there’s a shift just in alternate payment mechanisms writ large. Give you another example just on the DOD side, on the DOD side. And we’re looking at like money laundering or, or sanctions evasion or things like that.

[00:13:36] Analysts aren’t like. Oh, today I’m going to look at what crime is happening crypto. That’s not how it works. Right. They have a specific target, right? They’re looking at terrorist financing in this geographic region, or they’re looking at Russian sanctions, evasion, or they’re looking at, you know, what, what the Venezuelans are doing or whatever it is.

[00:13:54] Right. And they’re like, okay, how are these people moving money? And they’re never just doing it in [00:14:00] one thing or another thing. It’s a mashup of a bunch of stuff, right? They’re using crypto. They’re using. Alternate payment rails like Alipay or WeChat Pay, things like that, right? They’re trying to move money through bank transfers.

[00:14:12] They’re moving actual commodities, right? Gold, art, things like that. And through all of these methods, money moves globally. What we’re seeing is we’re seeing a large uptick in In tech driven value transfer, whether that’s crypto or like social media value transfer, things like that is a big trend for us now.

[00:14:32] and I think it’s only going to grow in the future. So how you combine those things together and identify the actual, you know, in the DoD example, identify the bad guys as part of what we’re doing.

[00:14:41] Luke: And I would imagine too, I mean, just to kind of take it back, I mean, like with everything happening in Ukraine too, and in other areas, I mean, this applies to every conflict.

[00:14:48] I mean, basically wherever we’re doing appropriations, right. Or, or, or trying to kind of get aid and tracking that aid, you, you always hear about this, right? Like, okay, well, we gave like a hundred billion, how much of it ended up on the back of a truck or, you [00:15:00] know, how many of these things happen. And, and, you know, then you’re also hearing things like, okay, well, Okay.

[00:15:04] In this conflict, they’re using tech in a different way. They’re using it to like, help to do payments through an app or all these other things. seems like a real testing ground for a lot of things, but I would imagine too, aside from tracking the bad guy activity, that there’s ways to use this stuff to benefit, just making sure that tech dollars aren’t getting churned out.

[00:15:21] Adam: Wasted? Yeah, yeah, which would be nice if we had something like

[00:15:24] Luke: that. I mean, like, you know, I know these are tall orders as a taxpayer, but

[00:15:29] Adam: you know. It’d be great if like, yeah, if like the loans, you know, like the money that we’re giving to Ukraine was actually tracked, like we knew what happened to it after we gave billions of dollars and like half of it just disappears.

[00:15:43] Yeah. no, you’re exactly right. I don’t want to speak out of turn, but I’m pretty sure Circle is doing some really good work here with the UN. Oh, nice. I think they’re trying to, at least to some degree, they’re using USDC, like UN payments. Oh, cool. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I offered not Shout [00:16:00] out to circle, but I offered to like for free and go and be like, they want it to be like the tracking mechanism behind that, right?

[00:16:06] It’s like, watch where those funds are being spent, how they’re being spent. Track things like, are people complaining about use cases, stuff like that. Yeah. I think there’s a lot of good that can be done here. Unfortunately, right. It’s just like, you know, Obviously criminals have to be innovative, right?

[00:16:20] So they’re the first movers out of time with new tech. Always, right? Like, but everybody else will get there. I mean, it’s, happening. Good things are happening and we want to be a part of that too.

[00:16:28] Luke: Well, and then that’s why I wanted to have you on too. Cause I think, you know, so much of this gets just thrown out in hyperbole and stuck in kind of these old circular arguments positions around like why we do something where in the reality is, is okay, it’s happening.

[00:16:41] I suspect that. The U. S. is not going to allow itself to farl much farther behind than we already have been by some of the reactionary policies that have gone in place or enforcement activities or whatever. What’s really standing out to me from talking to you here is just how much, like, this is working on both sides of the coin where it’s, you know, it’s helping to bring clarity and show the strengths of, you know.

[00:16:59] What this [00:17:00] technology can do while also going after, you know, making sure that criminal activity is getting monitored with this technology. So that’s a benefit of it. Right. How do you guys kind of ensure the ethical, responsible use of the data and analytics when you guys were looking at this stuff, especially like some of the sensitive nature I would imagine of the data that you guys were looking at, even if it’s public, how do you guys position around that whole ethical, responsible

[00:17:19] Adam: use?

[00:17:20] We try and it’s a, I think it’s a question that we wrestle with daily, right? What are our left and right limits? Yeah. I mean, so first thing I would say is everything that we take as public, but right, you combine these different publicly available data sets. And all of a sudden it’s a very, very powerful data set, even if it is all public.

[00:17:39] We need to watch out for who we are providing data to. The biggest challenge is not making an end run around the protections, the legal protections, or otherwise that are in place at like, you know, law enforcement agencies or otherwise, where they would obtain a particular type of data set through the court system, regardless of what you think of the system.

[00:17:58] At least we have some [00:18:00] system in place to get access to particular types of data. One very easy example is like USPII. If you’ve got law enforcement an intelligence agency, they should not be collecting, without the proper procedures in place, USPII, person’s name, address. Let’s just break down what

[00:18:15] Luke: PII means the audience, just in case anybody’s not familiar with the acronym.

[00:18:20] Adam: Personally Identifiable Information. And there’s a lot of caveats to this, right, and a lot of rules around it. But generally speaking, there’s a system in place to obtain. Personally identifiable information on you and there are protections that you have again, we can like putting aside the debates on who follows it and who doesn’t, which government agency is that following, although putting all those things to the side.

[00:18:40] Or even

[00:18:40] Luke: regionally, right? I mean, like where, you know, in Europe, they’ve got one set of framework around what this stuff is versus the U. S., right?

[00:18:46] Adam: Yes, exactly. So I think those are some of the challenges that we run into. We are always wrestling with that, and sometimes we don’t have easy answers. I would also say that for the most part, our clients also do, you know.

[00:18:57] So for a lot of our clients, they make us at the [00:19:00] outset mask. Any us person’s information. So we’re going out and we’re collecting information on I’ll just give you one example, we did an operation looking at illegal Chinese fishing vessels in South America, which is a bigger issue for other reasons.

[00:19:16] It’s they’re typically like trafficking networks in South America that are being used for, you know, with these illegal fishing vessels, we were looking at those and looking at. The funding flows between them and a lot of it was in crypto gather a lot of publicly available information ultimately on who was doing this, what their wallet addresses were down to the person names, the company names, everything.

[00:19:36] Anytime that we had a US person name, it was masked. The end user client did not have access to that in order to get access to that, the intelligence community member had to send that over to law enforcement, law enforcement had to go through the court system and then ultimately to get that access to that information.

[00:19:52] So that’s what we try to do. I’d like to think that my background as a prosecutor helps, but I’m not that good of a lawyer. So I have actually, I have actually good lawyers [00:20:00] now that help me out with that side. No, but it’s, a constant challenge. And as, as, especially as data moves open, like there’s more and more data that’s, that’s available open.

[00:20:09] I don’t think it’s going to get any easier, so I don’t, I don’t have any good answers, but. We’re cognizant of it and trying to make it work.

[00:20:14] Luke: Yeah. I mean, everybody’s making reasonable best effort, right? I mean, I think this stuff is moving so fast and moving across finance and it’s moving across, you know, privacy and all these different things.

[00:20:24] It’s just like I don’t know. I feel like everybody that works in crypto as part lawyer, if you’re in it for a year or longer anyway, or law firms and I feel like law firms and accountants are probably the biggest benefactor of any Bull or bear market. This is the world we’re in, you know, and I think it’s super interesting too, that what the work that you guys are doing is something that, I mean, people know, you know, chain analysis and other folks like that, but what you guys are doing bigger than that.

[00:20:48] I mean, even outside of forensics and you touched on a bunch of the examples here, but is there any other examples that you wanted to surface or talk about where that might be of interest to our audience you know, outside of just general forensics and crypto? Yeah. Yeah. [00:21:00] So I

[00:21:00] Adam: would say, you know, the difference is forensics obviously plays a huge role in risk management and compliance.

[00:21:05] In crypto, right? But ultimately what they’re doing, think about it like this. they’re basically taking like a bottom up view of compliance and risk management, right? So they’re starting at blockchain and what you’re able to do ultimately is you’re able to watch funding flows, which is extremely complicated because of all the different ways that you can use to hide funds, right?

[00:21:22] Funding flows from wallet A to wallet B to wallet C to wallet D and so forth. So they’re doing that and then they’re tagging those wallets along the way. So they’re saying, you know, this looks like a wallet that was used in the scam. This looks like it’s a, you know, a centralized coin base wallet. This looks like it’s a wallet used by Garantex, which was a Russian crypto exchange that was recently sanctioned.

[00:21:43] That is what they’re doing. And that job is hard. And that’s why there’s an entire industry around it. What we’re doing is a little different. we’re almost taking a top down approach to data analytics, right? So we’re saying, okay, what is the open source world of information that we have access to?

[00:21:57] The general three buckets are market data, [00:22:00] what we call technical data, which is blockchain data, data from GitHub repos, dark web data, all of that type of data, and then natural language data. So data from social media news and the open web, we have an entire NLP team that does nothing but build social media connectors and collect data from the open web.

[00:22:17] Then we grab all of these data sets and then we say, okay, what does the industry need to do their jobs? Is that ecosystem monitoring for a particular token? Is it market data analytics? Are we concerned about what’s happening with a particular token or a particular exchange as a leading indicator for something bad that’s going to happen in the future?

[00:22:34] As sanctions go global, just as one example, there’s no OFAC. List that you can just go to and find every sanctioned entity in the United States, right? Like that doesn’t exist You have to let go and dig through Hundreds if not thousands of pages to find the companies that are sanctioned solving even an easy problem like that Like we’ve got a tool that will give to any startup that’s worried about it That has not just wallet addresses but person names and company names of [00:23:00] sanctioned individuals globally Just to make sure that they’re on the right side of that Where can we go out easily grab OSINT and then create products?

[00:23:06] You know, the analogy is kind of like preventative versus investigative is the difference. And I don’t think the answer is either or it’s, it’s both for like most financial services that are in crypto or in need of, you know, cutting edge tools. We’re seeing a lot of use cases that are not crypto anymore.

[00:23:21] We’ve got banks coming to us asking us to do counterparty risk management on, on the companies that they bank or, Hey, can we use social media to monitor for bank risk? Stuff like that is, is where we’re moving into.

[00:23:34] Luke: Super interesting. Thanks again. For folks that are interested in the topic, are there resources you’d encourage them to check out?

[00:23:40] And is there anything we didn’t really touch on here that you wanted to get out there for, for our audience to know about INCRE or just stuff in general?

[00:23:47] Adam: So I would say on resources on this topic, there isn’t a ton, at least in national security space. If you’re interested in that, I think War on the Rocks does a pretty good job of reporting on like new tech in the [00:24:00] space.

[00:24:00] That’s on the DOD and the IC side though. Other than that, everybody that’s listening, you’re free to reach out to us. You can just reach out to info at Inca dot digital. I personally get all of those emails along with a couple other people on my team. We’ve got a pretty cool intelligence page that goes through like some of our work and our research in different areas.

[00:24:17] And a lot of it is way over my head on the technical side. If you want to learn more about how we’re doing natural language processing, using custom models. Integrating chat, GPT and stuff like that. All of that is in there because, you know, my teams are doing some, some pretty cool stuff.

[00:24:33] Luke: Where can people find you social are you out there on social?

[00:24:36] are you keeping a lower profile than that?

[00:24:38] Adam: I’m trying to keep a lower profile than that. Yeah. I, I, I, I, I, that, protection of PII. I’m like, just ignore this Adams Arabinski comment here.

[00:24:51] Luke: All of you listeners to you might want to, you know, just keep that in mind. Well, I really appreciate you coming on and yeah, I’d love to [00:25:00] have you come back to you we kind of move forward in the space and more of the stuff gets fleshed out, but yeah, thanks so much for, for joining us today.

[00:25:05] Thank

[00:25:06] Adam: you. Thank you for your time. Thanks to everybody that’s listening. Yeah, really appreciate it. And happy to come back whenever you want me, man. Awesome,

[00:25:11] Luke: man. Thanks. Super interesting discussion. Thanks for listening to the brave technologist podcast to never miss an episode. Make sure you hit follow in your podcast app.

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